“Yes, that’s 90+% on first dates. Unless you’re older (35 and up), I’d say you should be closing consistently at this rate”

How about the age comment? You didn’t explain it.

Geez! I’ve screwed more dates that I tought.

I read the PDF. Afraid it’s still not really adding up to me; even at 50% I’d have at least an extra dozen notches for the year so far, which seems kind of ridiculous at my modest skill level.

Although, one comment does strike home for me: “You shouldn’t be getting LMR from your dates either. If you do, then you’re coming across incongruent or they don’t know if you really like them or not.” I’ve definitely gotten LMR from girls who I wasn’t terribly interested in. And that’s part of it for me: sometimes I’m just *not* all that genuinely interested.

zorgon: Then why the hell are you going on dates with them?

I suppose I should mention another exception, and that’s online game. If you’re getting most of your dates from online, then that can explain a lot as well.

Everything above should be applied to day 2’s.

As for the “over 35″ comment, I suppose I should have said, if SHE is over 35 then you may run into more resistance. I’ve just noticed and from older guys I’ve talked to, older women are a bit more traditional and want to have the classic “two dates and a movie at my place” before they sleep with a guy.

There are always exceptions, but that’s just what i’ve heard.

“Then why the hell are you going on dates with them?” For practice. Actually, I’ve stopped doing this; at this point I’m only bothering to pursue women who I’m fairly interested in. My number of first dates has dropped off a cliff, partly because of this and partly because I’ve gotten fairly burned out by the community (which is a long story in its own right).

Maybe a third of my dates this year have been from online. The other two thirds from night game cold approach.

I don’t really do a lot of “dating” since I prefer (have to) get girls the same night. but 90% sounds like a more than reasonable figure.

But in regards to the “over 35″, I think I’ve noticed the opposite. Not that I go for women over 35 very often…but when I do, I tend to find them to be a lot more sexually open due to the fact that they’ve “been there, done that” and have (for the most part) gotten over their sexual hang-ups….but who knows!? I like the young girls.

Thanks Mark. This is very helpful.

“As for the “over 35″ comment, I suppose I should have said, if SHE is over 35 then you may run into more resistance. I’ve just noticed and from older guys I’ve talked to, older women are a bit more traditional and want to have the classic “two dates and a movie at my place” before they sleep with a guy.

There are always exceptions, but that’s just what i’ve heard.”

That’s the opposite of what happens to me, with women around my age (36) everything is smooth and easy, with young girls (22-28) it takes me longer to have sex with them. I think young women like me but at the same time they are scared about me due to my age.

Thanks, this is really good advice. I signed up for the free downloads and received the confirmation email, but never received the download email. A friend of mine said that it didn’t work for him either. Is there another way to download the material?

Check your spam folders.

I’ve tried a few times; I added the two addresses to my safe list as well.

Shoot me an email: entropy@practicalpickup.com

This has been happening recently. My autoresponder service needs to be shot.

There are some girls who just aren’t going to sleep with you on the first date, no matter how good you are. Even if you’ve been gaming her for four months already

FFS, it’s not the end of the world if it happens on the second date … or if it happens months later. Guys do NOT need to be getting their boxers in a knot over this. Escalating too fast can be just as much of a disaster as escalating too slowly.

Though it does turn me on when a guy takes the lead sexually … but just cuz I don’t sleep with ANY guy the first night (and NEVER have, in my entire life) doesn’t mean I’m not attracted to him …

Erika raises an interesting point. The general view in the community is that you should close on d2 (first date) and if you haven’t slept with her by d3 (second date), its best to forget her and move on. However, that is the not the view in the mainstream. In fact reading stories on some dating websites, you hear of cases where it took months. Amongst my non-community and non-natural friends, d3 would probably be on the early side.

Is it that community guys have difficulty hooking up with girls on slow burn ..several months down the line? Or is that in reality it is very hard to hook up after the second date, which is why the mainstream hails it as the ‘miracle’ of finding love?

The community is often far more accurate than the mainstream, of course. In my own experience, if I don’t get close to sleeping with a girl by d3 (i.e. both in bed with most clothes off, regardless whether or not we actually sleep together that night), then I am extremely unlikely to lay her.

I think part of the difference may be because in the community guys are principally talking about cold approaches in a bar, or on the street. Cold approaches have a certain momentum and if that is lost, then it makes less and less sense for you to meet, given different social circles, no other connection etc.

If you meet a girl through social circle then you are bound to keep seeing each other, so eventually…you will hook up.

Or by chance…that must be common too. I once met a girl in a dance class. A month later we went on a date and nothing happened. I moved to a new city and forgot about her. Then 5 months later she happened to move to the same city and I accidentally included her on a forwarded email. She replied and had recently moved to the same city. We met up, had amazing chemistry and slept together on the next date. In her words ‘I wasn’t ready for you before; its only since I have grown as person..’. Girls love such stories, but you can hardly rely on such a serendipitous series of events. Plus, while I am sure she had ‘grown as a person’, and we had undeniably better chemistry, I think the fact that she was alone in a new city and had just been dumped by her boyfriend had something to do with it as well.

So perhaps it is just that many couples take longer than two dates to hook up, but for every girl/guy they do hook up with after 2 dates, there are probably 4 times as many they didn’t. PUAs are always aiming for consistency and 100%. Not just to bang as many girls as possible, but because for a beginner or even intermediate guy, it is disastrous to spend a month pining over a girl they will probably never get, and much better to be gaining experience with new women.

My other thought is that , if we exclude quick hook ups (d1, d2), then quite likely the girl is considering you as a potential boyfriend if you meet again for d3. So there will be a lot of questions in her mind…is he the right one, isn’t he etc…food for discussion with her girlfriends. The longer you leave it the more chance she will find a reason you are not the one, get distracted by other things, meet someone else, or the sexual tension will drop and she will decide she only ever saw you as a friend…etc. Whereas if you have slept with her on d2, it is much less likely that she will get distracted by other things, meet someone else, or LJBF you and if she finds something she doesn’t like then she is more likely to put up with it for a while and try to ‘change’ you.

Just thinking out loud here, I don’t claim any particular expertise. What do others think?

It’s up to your discretion. I just teach guys to know the difference between the situations. Basically, the longer you wait to have sex, the more of a relationship and commitment frame you end up setting. The sooner you have sex, the more flexibility and choice each person has in pursuing the relationship. I generally teach guys to have sex as soon as possible.

There are guys in the community who won’t call a girl if she doesn’t put out the first night. That’s their choice.

I’ve dated a few women who I had to wait until the second, third, even fourth date. For what it’s worth, my current girlfriend (going on 2 years) started as a same night lay.

And finally, for the “over 35″ comment, I was referring to women dating MEN over 35. It’s true that women over 35 will often just want to fuck a young guy’s brains out. But men over 35 tend to run into the “let’s take things slow” thing a lot with women their age.

There are always exceptions, but I’ve had enough 35+ students mention this that it must be true in a lot of cases.

I am so up with men learning how to approach women and initiate conversations and dates. AND it seems this all about getting laid. Am I making the correct assumption? Is there a point beyond getting laid for this program? Developing a great relationship? Just wondering….

Tracy: If they so choose, that question is beyond the scope of this article. Trust me, there are PLENTY of articles on this website about getting into relationships and keeping relationships with the right women.

I agree with everything here except the advice against taking her out to dinner.

My standard M.O. is to go out for afternoon drinks on “date” #1. Just spend an hour or two having fun conversation, being entertaining, and telling stories. It’s not even a date, just a quick meeting for drinks. I get the benefit of having one “date” out of the way without spending significant time or money.

Then on the 2nd date, I take her to a quiet restaurant very close to my house. I’ve had to tell the waiters there to pretend not to know me since they see me so often and I don’t need to deal with that.

This is where I lay it on heavy and be as charming as possible and work on building comfort. Then I change venues to a bar next door where we have a drink and I use my favorite line: “Listen, I had only planned for us to have dinner tonight and not anything else. But I’m really enjoying your company. Let’s go over to my house and watch a DVD and have a glass of wine. I live one mile from here.” 90% or more will say yes, and at that point it’s a slam dunk.

good article, but a lot of bullshit in the replies.

I would say that in today’s environment all adult women are at least mentally prepared to have sex on the first date. What this means is that the difference between getting laid and not getting laid is the impression you make and the flow of the date towards the bedroom. An attractive guy with skills will definitely get laid almost every single time, the exceptions would be because of outside circumstances like car breakdown, she gets sick, etc.

As far as older women being more difficult HA HA HA jokes on you pal ! Women in their 30’s want sex more, and are more comfortable with sex, and are better at sex, than really young girls.